Barking Owl peformed a variety of tasks from music arrangement to sound design on a number of spots, including the Budweiser “Old School Delivery” commercial that saw the return of the Clydesdales; Booking.com’s “Body Doubles” featuring many Tina Feys; Etsy’s cinematic “Thank You France;” and Starry’s entry with Ice Spice dumping a Lemon-Lime soda once the infatuation loses its fizz.

We caught up with Bayett to talk about the vibe at Barking Owl during the rush to meet tight Super Bowl ad deadlines, why her company is literally one of the rare shops in the industry that hires women (yes, multiple women, not just one woman!) and, of course, the work itself.

Share your Super Bowl LVIII stats.

We did sound design and mix on five, sound design on one, music arrangement on the iconic Budweiser Clydesdales piece, original music on one and a music license on one more.

How does this compare to the amount of work you’ve done for previous Super Bowls?

In previous years, we have done between two and 11, so this year was exceptional at 7. We are very grateful and excited about it.

What was it like to juggle all that Super Bowl work this year? Did you have to bring in additional people?

When you have the gift of a lot of Super Bowl spots, you take a deep breath and dive in. Everyone is racing toward the same finish line with the same intensity. We didn’t need to bring in more staff. Our existing team was able to handle it.

What’s the vibe like around Super Bowl time? Does your team get pumped about working on projects that will be seen by such a huge audience? Or is it another day at the office?

The Super Bowl is a huge event, and it’s always amazing to be a part of it. It’s also great for our families, who get bragging rights at their Super Bowl parties.

Notice any trends this year?

Comedy is always huge. Lots of fun this year. That was really the order of the day.

Tell me more about some of the work, starting with the sound design in the Booking.com spot with all those Tina Feys.

Anything by director Nick Ball is amazing, and they had a strong producer in Jake Hermann, so you automatically know it’s going to be a fun ride. Sound design is always a funny thing, because if you are doing it properly, it feels like you haven’t done anything. Our job was to ground each Tina in her environment, so you were fully transported to that place in the story. Gus had so much fun coming up with sounds to channel the different locations. Birds seemed to do the trick with the most immediacy: a Carib grackle for the tropics, the old trusty red-tailed hawk for Wyoming, jays for the “farmstay.” The horse hooves are a blend of coconut shells and the real thing.

How about the sound design in Etsy’s epic “Thank You France” spot?

Mikayla Peterson is an amazing young sound designer and mixer, and she really knows how to find the subtleties. Finding little Easter-egg sounds [for the ad] so you feel like you are in the U.S. and France was key. We wanted to lean into the humor of historical inaccuracies, so Mikayla created a soundscape of France through the perspective of American stereotypes.

You also did the music for the star-studded Homes.com “Mascot” spot.

We have a really extensive library, and the track from that piece came from there. We used the first five seconds of a track to create an intro that really sets the tone for the entire ad.

There are women credited with working on Barking Owl’s Super Bowl projects, which is, sadly, a big deal because women are barely represented in the music space in the ad industry. Why is it so difficult for women to get opportunities?

I have been in this business for 25 years, and for most of that time, I was the only woman in the room. Even recently, I have experienced it. It’s an intimidating space, and one I have had to very carefully navigate. In audio programs, you find mostly men entering. Women are encouraged to be the singer and the beautiful face of something. We are not encouraged to be the drummer or the bass player. We are not encouraged to be behind the board.

It’s interesting, because a brand recently focused on some female music producers and engineers, and they just showed them giggling and laughing in the studio. It’s almost impossible for women to be shown in a serious way. To make women in power digestible, we have to giggle and laugh and be easy to look at.

I have made it my mission to bring in and empower women. They will not only have a voice here but be backed up when someone tries to keep them from speaking. To have diversity initiatives are important, but to have the people on your staff know they are heard and seen is a completely different level of commitment.

The understated design does a great job of subtly letting you know this album is going to be weird without revealing too much about the treasures inside.

Raul Lovisoni / Francesco Messina
Prati Bagnati Del Monte Analogo (1979)

The illustration of a sprawling cityscape on the water at night perfectly sets the tone for this album’s relaxed, strolling ambient pieces.

Bjørn Torske / Prins Thomas
Square One (2017)

The cover is a black-and-white collection of various clay-like faces. I normally associate these artists with sounds more immediately synthetic, but this album has a great deal of precision with acoustic origins. I think the cover art reflects the musical approach of working with organic/physical materials to make something new.

Cabo Boing
Blob On A Grid (2017)

Perhaps the best, truest, weirdo music being made today, the cassette and digital release packaging is just the perfect visual accompaniment to this music.

Hilary Stagg
Beyond The Horizon (1988)

The new age harp music album is blessed with a cover of two whales swimming in space with a blue planet behind them. I love listening to this album, thinking about those whales cruising through space and time, blissed out to these harp jams. It also reminds me of a time when the idea of two whales swimming in space wasn’t already co-opted into the trapper-keeper aesthetic.

Hama
Houmeissa (2019)

I bought this album because of the cover, and it did not disappoint. The composer poses with his keyboard, looking off into the distance while orbs float around, standing on a fading green and magenta grid. The music sounds exactly like that, and I love it.

Trio Da Kali / Kronos Quartet
Ladilikan (2017)

The artwork does an amazing job of centering the larger-than-life vocalist similarly to the arrangements of these recordings. The three-color photo and illustration collage shows how much can be done with a limited pallet, similar to this merging of ensembles.

Harald Grosskpof
Synthesist (1980)

The typography with the deadpan silver (or gold) painted Grosskopf is just the perfect cover for this forward-thinking album of synth and drum music.

George Crumb / Kronos Quartet
Black Angels (1990)

The cover for this album could easily be for a hardcore band—the painting, the typography, everything about it. I find the music to be the most terrifying and beautiful ever written. The album artwork shows the listener what awaits them, but nothing could prepare you for the first blast at full volume.

Come On
New York City 1976-80 (1999)

I remember buying this CD while in college on a trip to Kim’s in NYC in 2000. I bought it because of the cover, a black and white press photo of five nerds in matching white shirts with Helvetica typography. This is an amazing golden age of CBGBs era, NYC weirdo, angular rock music that I could see sharing the stage with Talking Heads, Devo, etc., but for whatever reason, they never found their breakthrough single. The cover is so upfront, but it still has mystique and intrigue.

Allow me to introduce myself, my name is Kelly Bayett and I am an excellent partner. Most of the time.

A common theme that comes up in bidding for work now is the request to be a great partner. I am seeing it across the board, in both the sound and production company. But what does it mean to be a good partner? 

In my experience, being a good partner means the following:

• Accepting that the job is underfunded
• Investing in the project
• Understanding there is not enough time to complete the ask, but making it work with OT and weekends at your own expense. 

Once you agree to be a good partner, you may not draw any boundaries. Throw away everything you learned in Al-Anon, because having boundaries means that you are now a bad partner. Even if you have drawn the boundaries at the start of the project, enforcing those boundaries will make you a partner that “puts everyone in a bad position.”

Partnership does not mean that it is mutual. If you think that by being a good partner, you are getting some creative control, think again. Being a good partner means that you will do what is asked of you. Push your agenda or opinions, and you are no longer a good partner. 

Here is an example on the post side. Recently, we were brought one of those big jobs for a billion-dollar company that had no money left for mix or sound design. They wanted two days of mix for the price of less than one day. We wanted to be good partners so we agreed. When we were given the eight spots to sound design in two days, we explained it just wasn’t possible and we would need a week to do the extensive sound design and mix. “But we were looking for good partners, and we thought that would be you. This is a disappointment.” Keep in mind, we had already agreed to a 67 percent reduction in costs, but that was not good enough. They left with a sour taste, because they wanted more than we committed to, and by drawing that boundary, we had taken advantage of them. 

An example on the production side would look like this. A job comes in that is filled with celebrities for another billion-dollar company. We are told the opportunity for our director would be incredible. We are also told that the client and their cost consultants expect us to be excellent partners and so they will anticipate our markup to be cut in half and to lower the director’s fees. As we get into bidding, we are also made aware that a full week of prep on an already compressed job will be cut. Any inability to meet all of these requirements will keep us out of the job, due to the fact that we are not a good partner. As you can imagine, I was a terrible partner on this one. 

I have a theory that in our rush to get things done, to please clients and keep jobs, the humanity has been lost and an irritation attached to entitlement has taken over. By throwing out the word “partner,” it makes you more invested and accountable. But what do we have at the end of the day? We partner up, but we are not financially invested in the outcome, as we have no actual ownership in anything. We don’t get product, and we are typically prohibited from putting the project on our reel or doing any PR. The word partnership has been turned into tool for manipulation. 

Even on the corporate level, I read that Starbucks calls their employees partners, “because they are partners in our shared success.” But are they? Is their portion of shared success 30 percent off food and drink and a pound of coffee a month? It’s modern-day gaslighting. Fool people into making them feel ownership in something that does not serve them. No, thanks. Pass.

If you want to actually partner, it’s pretty easy. I made it even easier with bullet points.

• Be open and honest about your expectations. 
• Accept that not everything may be possible in the way you want, but if we can all stay open and be creative, it will be done and might be even better than you thought.
• Be clear and transparent in your communication. If anything changes, be it schedule, deliverables, anything, let your partner know right away so they can figure out a solution. Partnership jobs are a challenge for any company and you are constantly trying to balance against other well-funded projects. 
• Patience is key. Sometimes we have to investigate the proper solutions and we can’t always agree immediately, but we can all agree to do the best we can. 
• Respect your partners and respect the process. Don’t make assumptions about how things are done. Ask them the best way, and trust their experience. 
• Appreciate your partners. Say thank you. Listen to their opinions. You have chosen them for a reason, and hopefully it’s not just because they are the only suckers who will do it. 
• Not every job is a partnership. Sometimes, you just need a favor. It’s OK and even appreciated to call it that. 
• Pay it back. Always.

There are times where we absolutely want to partner and invest. The creative level is high, the opportunity is great and the appreciation is mutual. The goal is to make great work and have fun in spite of facing new obstacles every day and battling them with creative responses. A true partnership is one of the most rewarding and wonderful experiences. I hope that everyone who utters that word from here on out experiences that version of partnership, to see how beautiful it truly can be.

I love that Wayne Coyne created the visual component for this album and story. When artists’ visions extend into auditory and visual realms, their creations feel so much more palpable to me. You know these fantastical worlds exist in such detail in their minds. This cover conveys so many of those intricacies—the robot’s extra sets of tiny legs, the mysterious “25” on the wall, the blood spatters from a previous showdown. I’d take one-fifth of Coyne’s imagination if it were up for grabs.

Wire
Pink Flag (1977)

Sometimes simplicity can be a very alluring and memorable approach. Are we golfing? Where’s the grass? Oh, it’s a parade flag, eh? Is this a call to arms? “Three Girl Rhumba” had me feeling like I would have followed Wire to the edge of the earth. It’s very possible that my love for this album cover is solely driven by the music beneath it. This was one of the first punk albums I ever heard. I remember thinking, “Wait a minute, I fucking love this.” I went to Catholic school until college and was raised by a single mom (a glorious one) who would sooner throw herself off a bridge than listen to punk music. Now, am I saying I could have survived a Dead Kennedys show?  Hell no, catch me in the corner using someone … anyone … as a human shield. One of our mix engineers and a good friend of mine, AJ Murillo, has GG Allin tattooed on his shin … I’m well aware of how not punk I am. But for me, this album rides that golden fine line of being chaotically stirring but so pleasing on the ears at the same time. 

Thundercat
Drunk (2017)

You cannot listen to the lyrics of “Captain Stupido” while looking at this album cover and not laugh. You cannot. Thundercat is a brilliant anomaly of talent, and I love his mind. He’s remarkably original and skips across musical boundaries like nobody’s business, but I’m a sucker for the humor behind it all. “I feel weird/Comb your beard, brush your teeth.” “Still feel weird…” the next line is unfortunately inappropriate for such a publication, but the hilarity continues, I can assure you. I feel weird too, Thundercat. 

Blondie
Plastic Letters (1977)

I just remember thinking, “Damn, I want to be her.” This foxy, edgy young thing leaning off the bumper of a vintage cop car in a hot pink minidress. Keep in mind, I was probably in year five out of seven of my awkward phase at the time … greasy ponytail, braces as far as the eye could see, diagonal rubber bands affixed to the aforementioned tragedy. Debbie Harry is an inspiration and one of my favorites to belt in the car. Here’s hoping you never catch me at a stoplight. 

Funkadelic
Maggot Brain (1971)

It doesn’t get more striking and memorable than this—a perfect visual introductory to brace you for the beautifully dark psychedelic and incredible funk tunes inside. Simple as that, it’s perfect. George Clinton is a legend.  

Nick Drake
Pink Moon (1972)

This is such an incredible painting from Michael Trevithick. It’s so surreal and reminiscent of Dalí, and it really captures that haunting emotional space of the album itself. I love the composition and how those droll eyes stand out in that clown-like visage against the dark, eerie backdrop. I like the idea of one artist understanding another artist’s message so deeply that they can create a visual counterpart to this degree.

Frank Zappa and the Mothers of Invention
Over-Nite Sensation (1973)

My vinyl collection is oh, so limited (I’m freshly 28, so please cut me some slack). However, I do own this one on vinyl. The strange and perverse details are endless—a wonderfully complex peek at life on tour for Zappa: crushed Coors cans, McDonald’s remnants, mysterious limbs, terrifyingly unappetizing donuts, a half-robotic/half-possessed arm reaching for a cigarette. It has it all. 

Papa Bear & His Cubs
You’re So Fine (2019)

This album cover is so sweet that it prompted a little research into the music. What I found did not disappoint. Eddie Disnute Sr., aka Papa Bear, and his six kids making blissfully soulful tunes together!? Picture them singing “Sweetest Thing on This Side of Heaven” for his wife and the idea of domestic utopian bliss might just be reborn. These songs just have the loveliest, warmest, enveloping feel to them, I wish there were more. 

Patti Smith 
Horses (1975)

Just Kids is one of my favorite books. I love Patti Smith and Robert Mapplethorpe’s love story and life stories. They had such a beautiful connection and influence on one another as artists. In my book, they’re both geniuses so you can’t go wrong with a collaboration like this. He was a pioneer of photography, and his use of lighting and composition was incredible. I remember her saying she had to go buy a clean white shirt from the thrift store for this shoot. In this instance, it’s the story behind it that draws me in. And then you have Patti Smith’s unbelievable talent and lyrical spirit lying beneath. Amen. 

The Velvet Underground
The Velvet Underground & Nico (1967)

So, I’m sure this album cover has been selected dozens of times in this column, but my reason for loving it must be singular. My family is totally obsessed with bananas. For the Benton family, bananas cure all. Headache? Banana. Tired? Banana. You broke your finger? Hospital, then banana. Oh, yeah and it’s a Warhol. I would give anything to have seen Velvet Underground play with Nico, likely with Warhol in the audience. This album has a way of making you feel like angst is good and normal and the right thing to feel. There’s such a perfect balance of delicacy and chaos to it. 

In our conversation below, edited and condensed, Bayett discusses her work and the state of equality in the industry today.

Muse: Why is this project important to you? How does you own race and background play into it?

Kelly Bayett: I’m white. Growing up we didn’t have money, and I went to a big public school. The school bussed in students from different areas of the inner city and they were treated poorly by parents and other students. The Rodney King riots happened during my junior year of high school, and that brought about an even deeper understanding of what my privilege meant. [Because we were white] no one from the neighborhood ever complained that we were not wealthy enough to go to school there. No one ever worried that I might steal from them.

I also work with a nonprofit called Defy Ventures. We go into prisons and work with incarcerated individuals. We call them EITs—Entrepreneurs In Training. We help them create ideas and put together businesses. We do résumé coaching, personal statements and practice interviews. Since quarantine, we have been working with those who were recently released, helping them to get their ideas into practice, how to apply and interview for a job. It gives people a second chance who never had a fair first chance.

For the Barking Owl Sessions, how do you pick the artists and handle production?

We don’t care how popular or how many likes they have, we just look for people who are exceptional. I was excited by the idea, but I had no idea how to fully accomplish it. My East Coast rep, Diane Patrone, suggested I reach out to Michelle Craig at UNIT9. She took on the direction and all visual aspects of the project. We source talent, handle the audio, and it’s done in our studio. We work with the CDC guidelines as well as SAG guidelines to keep everyone safe. Crew is minimal, everyone wears masks, no one can come in with any flu symptoms. We keep people distanced. None of us takes this virus lightly.

What’s the long-term goal?

The initial idea was to create an event with IG Live that would attract viewers, and then a YouTube channel for the musicians that would turn into a resource where people can find incredible talent for licensing and partnerships. We still want that, but we also realized that we could make fantastic content for the artists to use however they like. Problem is releasing his session as individual videos and also releasing the tracks. We are also working on a possible event that will focus as a record release around [his album] Coffee and Kush Vol. 2. We want to give artists the access to the brands that could help make them real money. Streaming services won’t do it for you.

Do the sessions themselves present sponsorship opportunities?

We will be looking for sponsors for each show. The sessions have blown up with an audience that we never expected to touch. It has also become an event that the public is responding to. We keep upping the production game, and it’s getting expensive, so we are looking to get some financial support for production.

Can you talk about each episode, what makes them special?

Problem … he’s this independent hip-hop legend. He writes and performs, and he has reinvented himself so many times. This new album is insane. It’s so musical. Having him perform with a live band culminated in an experience that felt intimate and warm. 

Jodie Jo is at the other end of the spectrum. He is young, from the Inland Empire and had never performed before aside from the odd open mic. He uses strings, horns, and creates hooks that won’t leave your mind. I wanted to introduce the world to someone completely new and unexpected. 

Shane Eli has a very different vibe than the other two. His energy is really high, and he makes music that makes you want to get up and do something. It hits you to your core, and Michelle wanted to do something visually that reflected that.

Michael B. Jordan shared Problem’s set across social, yes?

Problem’s session was posted by Michael B. Jordan on Instagram, and it was also picked up by a bunch of hip-hop outlets. People love them and they are starting to look forward to the next session, which is key. Problem’s session had over 40,000 views in a week.

Showcasing Black artists is great, but in a broader sense, given the political climate today, do you think we’ll make real progress in the push for equality?

In the ad business, people seem to think that if they make a Black woman a vice president, they have solved their cultural problem. But the issue is much bigger than that. There are deeper cultural issues that need to be addressed. BIPOC need to feel accepted and be encouraged to grow. People stress putting women and people of color at the top, and I believe in that, but you also have to look at the opportunities you are providing. Are you investing in communities? Are you creating mentorships? Are the people who are contributing to a toxic culture being dealt with, or are you continuing to turn a blind eye? Is the pay for BIPOC and women equal to that of white males? People are doing consciousness and diversity meetings in agencies, and that is great, but you must follow through, or your words are empty.

What will it take to affect real change?

If we are relentless, I do believe things will change. But it won’t be a fast process. It is a long, hard road to undo hundreds of years of oppression. It takes everyone. We can’t get bored with the movement. We have to acknowledge that as white people we don’t understand the struggle and acknowledge that we have made mistakes and we will continue to make mistakes, because the challenges of BIPOC are not our personal experiences due to our privilege. If we can all keep fighting, as I intend to, then it will change.

Apart from the sessions, can you talk about a couple of recent Barking Owl projects you’re proud of?

One was the P&G Pride piece with Wieden + Kennedy. It was such a simple and sweet execution, but it was so powerful. The piece of music was from our library and we didn’t even have to touch it—it was perfect.

We also did a project with TBWAChiatDay for the Grammys about women in music and it was one of my favorites.

On a totally different note, we mixed the Klarna campaign with Miramar, and every time a new spot would come in I would marvel at how odd, smart and funny it was.

Are you a musician?

I am a singer, and the only band I ever played in was a kids’ punk band. Kids are the best audience. They jump on stage, dance with you and they are never too cool for the room. All kinds of music inspire me. I love music that comes from your heart and soul. I don’t care what genre it is. You can tell when someone gives their whole heart to something and that is what I am attracted to: music that makes you feel something. I have always loved music, theater, storytelling and production, so when I found this career it was the absolute perfect choice.

How did you get on this particular path?

I waited tables and slung coffee for a while before my aunt hired me as her personal assistant. She and her husband were CDs at Chiat, and they left to start their own production company called Radio Savant. They ran an amazing company from their house. Eventually I started going to sessions, and my aunt taught me how to produce.

When the [2007-08] SAG strike happened, I answered an ad for a music production company called Tomandandy. I thought I would have a knack for it. I love music, and I knew enough about advertising. It was a difficult job, but they taught me so much. I went from there to Stimmung where I worked as an EP for 7½ years. In the midst of a divorce and with nothing to lose, my boyfriend (now husband) and I started Barking Owl in our house with no reel, no reps and no bio. I was incredibly confident, slightly naïve, relentless and resourceful.

My goal was to create a place where we could make music and sound that we loved. We wouldn’t do rips—we would invest in artists and grow in any direction the wind took us. We knew our vision was for the long game. We didn’t want to sacrifice quality for a quick win. We knew we might not win everything, but hopefully, we would attract like-minded people. And we did.

For the Ella Mai piece, the first version [out of the four videos] had to feel clean and warm and beautiful and simple. And then you had to take that feeling and make it evolve throughout the other three pieces. Her producer supplied the elements, but when we got to the fourth chapter, it was just so obvious the horns were fake—but you see a real marching band, and it took some of that beauty and excitement out of it. You can’t fake horns. That’s one of the things that MIDI just can’t get right. There’s a human imperfection, and there’s a power with the wind through the instrument that sounds so incredible. So we brought in three more musicians. We recorded it all in two hours. We sent it back to her producer. He mixed the live horns in, and the whole thing changed. It just felt like that last chapter became so alive. 

We did minimal sound design, but it’s treated more like a music video—and they don’t really use a ton of sound design. They kind of give an open and a middle and an end with sound design, but it’s typically about putting the song in the best light.

You also worked on quite a few Super Bowl ads this year. Any favorites? 
We did the Kia piece that I loved for the Telluride. Because it was a new car and we don’t get a lot of access, our team got to go to that Georgia/Alabama border and record the car in all of those environments. They helped facilitate a lot of the interviews for the behind-the-scenes video—we provided the sound design for that. And then for the featurettes and the teasers, we did the music and the sound design. We were able to create a soundscape that worked for everything, and that was a really nice piece to be a part of. That was with director John Hillcoat. 

We also did Expensify with JohnXHannes, which was really fun and wild. Each time you saw a new piece of their content, you would be like, “How on earth did you sell this to anybody?” I don’t know how they do it, but they’re magicians. 

What other recent projects are you proud of?
There was a job we did for Macy’s called “Lighthouse.” It’s really beautiful. There’s something about a woman singing and one instrument—and it’s done all the time! In this case, we found the song to rearrange—a Black Keys song called “Everlasting Light.” And the woman who sang it, Sarah Rayne, she was in a very vulnerable place in her life at the time. And when you listen to her sing that song, her voice sounds like it’s breaking. She’s emotional. It sounds like, at any second, she’s going to break down and start crying. It has this real truthful vulnerability to it. 

I started getting tons of emails from people trying to get a copy of it, because they wanted to walk down the aisle to it. They wanted to have their first dance with their father with it. It wasn’t released anywhere. [The spot] actually only played on The Voice one time, and then it was online. And there weren’t a lot of credits for it, so the amount of work people had to do to even find me, or find the song, is pretty exceptional. Anytime you do something and it touches people in a way where they want it to be part of their most important day, it feels you’ve done something right. 

How did you find Sarah?
Our composer, Brian Canning, has a long-standing relationship with her. He’s produced some bands that she’s in. She was very safe with him. They have a very intimate kind of relationship, so it was a place where she felt OK that she could do that. That’s why we let our composers choose their own singers, for the most part, because they really understand them, and they have a different understanding emotionally together. Better stuff comes out of that.

How about another piece you did lately? 
The other one is a whole job I’m so proud of—the Corazón piece that we did last year with JohnXHannes for Montefiore. 

Ah, yeah. I love that one.
It’s one of my favorite things I’ve ever done. John Hillcoat has a long-standing relationship with Atticus Ross, and so he really wanted Atticus to score it. Atticus said he would do it, but only if [Barking Owl] did the sound design and the mix as well. So we were able to put together a full soundtrack and we did some music licensing and we did all the sound design. 

We had to recreate the entire Dominican [scenes], because none of the sound from there was usable. It was all recorded in mono. We had to do the 5.1 mix. It was a really interesting and complicated project, but so rewarding and just so beautiful. I cried every single time we got to that visa scene.

It won so many awards—several Grand Clios, actually. 
Yeah, and it doesn’t feel like branded content. That’s what I love, too. It feels like a film that you’re watching. You’d never know it’s for a hospital. 

That must have been a big project. The film is also almost an hour long, right?
It was compressed for us. We had three weeks to do all the sound, from start to finish. So it moved fast. 

You also worked on the Google Assisant Ride at CES. That sounded pretty fascinating.
It was so fascinating. It was something we hadn’t done before, but it was also something Google hadn’t done before. So we were all in it together, which really helped. And the director was really in it together, too. At the end, we just really wanted great creative. 

We have a mixer named Mike Franklin—he’s our lead mixer. He’s incredibly technical. So, even though we’ve never been in an environment before where there’s six different scenes, and they’re giving us a layout as to how the ride goes, and where we want the speakers, and what goes into those speakers, we were able to really figure that out. You had music coming from the cars on the ride. That was a song that narrated the entire experience. And then we created each environment. Each one really had to feel different. You do as good of a job as you can mixing everything together and sound-designing it here [in L.A.]. But then we all had to go to Vegas and kind of remix in the rooms. We brought all of our gear so we could add sounds that were missing. 

When you have an experience where there’s seven cars on the ride, that first person’s experience is completely different from that last person’s. The first person is in the storm, but the last person hasn’t even hit the scene before the storm. So I would write it from that last car, and then go through and figure out what easter eggs we could give that last person so that they’re also having a good experience within the piece. It was a lot of just being nimble and being able to fix things on the spot and make it work. And Nexus [Studios] and Google were unbelievable to work with. 

The three-dimensional nature of that just changes everything. 
Everything. And when you add people to the cars, and the people are talking, now what does it sound like? Is the song loud enough? Are we loud enough in the space? Are we too loud in the space? There was a bakery, so the bakery had to come alive once you came in there. There’s a surprise party, and that has to feel alive. Every single thing you do has to feel different, and it has to feel like you’re really in that environment. 

How important are sound and music in commercials and marketing experiences generally?
It’s incredibly important. When you go to YouTube or anywhere there’s comments on an ad or a piece of branding, all anybody’s asking is, What’s the song? How do you get the song? It’s the thing they can feel. People have visceral reactions to it. They’ll love it or hate it, but at least they feel something from it, if it’s being done right. There’s a lot of things people can’t understand. They can’t really understand what a DP does, a lot of the time. But they can understand music, and they can understand sound, and how it makes them feel. It’s a very emotional piece of the puzzle at all times. It’s either bringing energy, or sometimes it’s brought in to save a spot that maybe it didn’t turn out as well as everybody thought it would. And the thing about sound design is, if it’s done really well, you don’t even notice it at all. But if it’s done poorly, it really stands out and it becomes a problem. 

Everyone has an opinion about soundtracks. 
Yeah. And everyone’s right, is the other thing. I can’t tell you your music taste is wrong compared to mine. Storytelling has a really nice rhythm to it, but I think what you do within telling those stories is what people will respond to. 

What’s your approach to music or sound design, or your philosophy behind the work you do? 
I love commercials; I love branding; I love music and sound. And I really look at it from a very authentic, emotional place. So, for me, I don’t really like to do rips. I don’t like to rip off other artists. It’s not interesting for the artist. Everybody knows that you’re ripping something off. So we really try to look at it from a very original point of view all the time. We bring in a lot of composers that don’t work with other companies, or they come from different backgrounds.

Let’s talk about artists and trends. Whenever a commercial uses a track from a band like Imagine Dragons, there’s some groaning—because it’s been done so much. Is there a danger of getting in a rut with certain types of music? 
I think why people groan, and why people feel a little frustrated by it, is because if something works one time, it becomes an easy answer for everybody. The originality is sucked out of it because people feel, “Oh, that formula works and we’re going to stick with it.” I don’t even know if it’s as much about trends as it is about laziness. There are trends. There was the whole Mumford & Sons alt-folk thing that happened for a while, and then when that’s over, it’s over. Everybody’s departed from it because everything feels of a certain time.

Formulas are formulas for a reason, but they can get stale pretty fast.
And it’s also not even formulas. It’s like, “Oh, we’re going to get a different song from this band because it works for Jeep, or whoever. And now we’re going to put it in this trailer. And now we’re going to use it for something else.” There an Ennio Marricone song like that, too, that people always want to put in everything—or they want you to rip it, and it doesn’t sound like anything else. Modelo’s using it right now, and Nike’s used it before. But as soon as you hear it, you think of so many different things, and so you don’t really get that attachment to one brand.

The industry’s changed a lot in the 10 years you’ve been in business. It seems like there’s much broader recognition about how important the music is to marketing. 
For a long time, it was the last thing people really thought about. They didn’t have any time or money for it, until they realized, “Oh, we need a really great music track.” I think a lot of people have been really afraid of this trend of licensing. But I think licensing has always happened. There’s a time where licensing is appropriate, and there’s a time when composing and storytelling is important and you need a score. I think a lot of that is helping people figure out what the answer is within their own storytelling. People put a lot of time into it now. 

The one thing that I will say is different—in a not-great way—is that there is a generation that has never paid for music. They don’t understand the value of it or what it’s worth. On the other side of that, people used to come in with a brief and say, “Hey, we want an up-and-coming band that we can get for cheap.” But if it’s an up-and-coming band that’s any good, they know their worth now. You’re not really getting a piece of music for $10,000 anymore. They know their value is much higher, and they know that the brand also benefits. Everybody’s gotten savvier. It’s actually harder to license those pieces, because you come in with a certain amount of money and they don’t accept it. Even if they have nothing, they feel like their value is higher.

What next for Barking Owl? 
We’re working on a lot of things I love right now. I can’t really talk about much of it, but we do have more experiential work that is totally new and exciting for us. And we have a lot of really incredible pieces for social justice. I’m especially touched when we’re able to be a part of projects like that.